So much for not blogging …
Eyeballed the reg stats a bit this AM, before things get a bit murkier with the registration tomorrow. Looking at this, it confirms for me something I already know … if you run a time, a place will come. That is not to say you don’t race. Of course you race. But races like that, ultras … your race is more about what you do and less about what you do in regards to your competitors. You do what you can and if the time plays out, the place will come. Run sub 20 at Leadville and you are top 10. Put down an 8:10 IM and chances are you will win (or at least beat Chrissie). Run sub 4:30 at Pikes and you probably “win” the masters for the men (the quotations are there because win is relative here … they take out any masters in the top ten and so that eliminates guys like Carpenter and Boettcher, but that is a separate rant).
I am not sure if I am going to make the choices between now and race day that most effectively set me up to run that sort of time, so … I try not to think about it. I mean, I do think about it, but I realize that thinking about it is probably more of a problem than a solution. If instead I focus on what I can do now or this week, and maximizing that … then it could work. But it might not.
Other various rants and ramblings …(ala Knuckledragger) …
Got this from JT … compression suits going too far? Maybe I need one of these for burro racing?
Boulder is considering adding a test for dogs for their green tag program for off leash use. I want to administer that test. I want to have the dog be off leash, and remain on stay, completely on voice control while I run a gaggle of turkeys in front of the dog. I am pretty sure there will be something like four dogs in all the county that pass the test. These dogs are blind and deaf.
JZ had a Scout meeting last night. He is no longer a Cub Scout, but now a Boy Scout. This was not his first meeting but it was probably their first “regular” meeting. TZ and I were there for some parent orientation, and so I got to watch some of the dynamics of the boys running a meeting. Pretty cool and pretty funny. Loud, but effective. Amazing to see young teens doing project management. Again, I am not sure how far JZ will go with Scouts, but how can you not be in favor of an organization that is looking to foster these ideals in young men? A Scout is Trustworthy, Loyal, Helpful, Friendly, Courteous, Kind, Obedient, Cheerful, Thrifty, Brave, Clean, and Reverent.
I found Lynette Carolla’s rant at the start of her podcast – regarding the “entitlement epidemic” interesting. Got to love her tag line on her podcast: “You’re a parent now. Don’t F it up.”
Summer is shaping up. Some chain saw camp. Maybe a trip with the Scouts to Yellowstone (and probably a bunch of other camping with them as well). PPM. Some burro racing perhaps. I want to get to the track for some BRR races. Spring has some business trips, including one back to Tel Aviv, one to San Fran (never have been there and I want to hit the Marin area for some running but I have no clue about any of that), and Ireland. Maybe some unicycle bagpipes in a kilt in a Darth Vader outfit.
I found Joanna Z’s post particularly close striking to home …
I am still waiting to see Karl’s luge video from this year (2012) … here’s the one from 2011.
Just nmp will groan at another podcast, I found this one interesting: Dave Horton – particularly where he discusses how his run across America put an end to him.
Mid day, 14.5 with Shad and Bob on the Dirty Bismarck out of Superior. Another warm day but I was fairly hydrated going in. Felt comfortable throughout this run, and even put in a few 6:30s towards the end (although down hill)
I'm ahead of the game this time. I already listened to that one! It was good, and I generally like the talk ultra stuff, but it is 2.5 hrs long...that is a bit long in my opinion and is partly why I was a bit wound up about all the podcasts. It shouldn't take 5 days of listening to get through a single episode.
ReplyDeleteAren't you an ultra runner? Meaning that your short run is like 4 hours?
ReplyDeleteWhat do you think about whether or not Matt Carpenter races?
ReplyDeletePart of me thinks it would be cool to see him line up against Kilian...but then part of me thinks there is no point of lining up a 47 (?) year old man against someone half his age. In reality, Kilian is running against Matt's ghost from 1994 (?) when he set the records.
You should run a poll estimating Kilian's ascent and round trip time.
Based on how many blog posts of mine you have linked to I'm not so sure...
ReplyDeleteGeorge, question.
ReplyDeleteThere are lots of newbie runners toying with the idea of running the Ascent, as is every year. Most, I'm quite sure have no idea. What general fitness would you recommend someone be in before giving it a shot? This was a quote I read on the interwebs today:
"I've only been running about a year and a half. I can pretty regularly run 5-10 miles at a pace between 7:45 and 8:45 (depending on distance and what kind of day I'm having). The routes I run are usually relatively "hilly" (nothing like a mountain). I typically try to run at least 5 miles per day 3 days per week, and then a 10ish mile run 1 day per week. I've run a 1/2 marathon (1:54) and a 5k (~24 and some change). The area in which I live is only about 1000ft above sea level. I'm in decent shape (could stand to lose 10-15lbs) and I think I could do this run. Has anyone on here ever done the Ascent before? Am I crazy? Suggestions/training tips? "
Obviously someone has to be in the back of the pack...but, hell, even I'M faster/fitter than that and there's no way I'd consider the Ascent yet.
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ReplyDeleteBeing a seal level flatlander myself, I wouldn't tell people they need to just beat the cutoffs or just the minimal registration requiremens.
ReplyDeleteIn a regular race, sure, that above would be my answer.
But at Pikes Peak, I would recommend sea level flatlanders run a marathon or a half marathon at a pace such that they think they have a chance to get close to 4 hours in the ascent. This recommendation is purely for safety's sake. There is no reason why someone just has to be fast, this is not an elitist sport or race. But I do think you need to be safe and not put yourself or others in a dangerous situation by getting caught in storms.
Brett - regarding Matt. I have no idea if he is running or not, but I can see a rationale on his part for either consideration. On a much smaller scale this year I have been asking myself (occasionally) why go back to run between four and six hours again? It is a little different for me of course because there is a sliver of belief that I could still PR there. Obviously it is different with Matt as what he did on the mountain then is not what he could do now - but he has continued to win. I just hope whatever he decides - he is happy with the outcome.
ReplyDeleteRob - Brett ... the overall cutoff for the Ascent is 6.5 hours (I think that is it). The average time a person does to get to the top is close to 4.5 hours. For what it is worth, this is about the average finishing time for major marathons in the US.
ReplyDeleteSo, in other words, you can GENERALLY take a marathon and translate it to what you would do on the peak. That said, if you are not hill trained or not altitude trained, you could be adding some time to that.
By the way, that little tidbit can get turned around ... folks that are well altitude and hill trained can ascend faster than what they can do a marathon in. I am pretty sure Glen Randall and Mario Macias are not gonna run a sub 2:10 marathon on the roads, but they did go under that in the climb.
So, could that person on the interwebs finish Pikes? Sure. Probably. They'd probably get up the hill in 4 to 5 hours. They'd probably suffer quite a bit off that level of training and be walking nearly all of the race from Barr Camp, or at least A frame. The question becomes then - "is that what that person wants?"
I occasionally think because I know how to swim, and bike I could finish an IM under the cutoff of 17 hours. I don't want that though. If I did it, I'd want to suffer at least 5 to 6 hours less than that. But I am not willing to train for that (because it is not something that is compelling to me at current), and so I won't do it.
Alternatively, I did a 100 miler off the wrong training. Paid for that I did.
Not sure I am answering your question. Maybe more directly I would say if you are gonna sign up for a race of that magnitude, and are training that little - it makes sense to up the ante.
(I know that ain't you btw, and I think you could do it).
Oh yeah, Brett does raise a good point. Sometimes the Ascent actually is 20 miles with over 5000 feet of gain.
ReplyDeleteThe blind, deaf dog thing made me laugh out loud ( not to be confused with LOL).
ReplyDeleteAscent list is looking good already. Marathon less so, but good to see at least one guy (Nichols) who usually runs the Ascent step up to the big boys' race.
ReplyDeleteMy prediction on Kilian: no faster than 2:10 to the top, down in 1:15/16.
I was thinking Kilian could go a few minutes lower than that on the way up, but be a few minutes slower on the way down. But then I remember how he ran down K2 and I don't know. Can he descend more than 5 minutes faster than Mackey on his best day? Seems possible I suppose...but shit.
ReplyDeleteSara, those are the best voice controlled dogs.
ReplyDeleteNick - the Ascent of course has been the stronger of the fields up front for quite a few years now (at least as long as I have been playing there).
You have seen Kilian up close so I trust your judgment. 2:10 to the top in the marathon is smoking fast (given that times slightly faster won the Ascent outright).
That said, isn't Kilian a bit more renown for his downhilling?
Fastest down in sort order here: http://www.skyrunner.com/search/find.asp?Race=M&DNFs=No&Blanks=No&Sort=Dwn
On San Fran - it is worth getting out to Marin if you can make it work. After going every year for the past 5 years I finally made it out there on my last trip. It is a bit of a trek but is some nice running. Otherwise (depending on where you stay in the city of course) I usually run early in the morning by the Pier and Fort Mason to avoid dealing with traffic/streets in the city.
ReplyDeleteHaving seen him run uphill at WS, KJ is certainly no slouch on the climbs. AT UTMB I recall he basically ran away from everyone on the climbs and then hung out on the summit waiting...so I would guess he will run a fast ascent.
Speaking as someone who moved out here five years ago from 500 feet above sea level, I can say that simply being a runner makes up for a lot of the altitude thing. I agree with GZ, 4-5 hours is about right. I'm pretty sure I can hit the top in 4.5 during a steady recreational run, and I doubt I can run much under 2 hours for a half.
ReplyDeleteMy compression pants don't have the big gap in the back like those. I guess they're not the ultra runner model.
So will Kilian be at his computer at 1pm tomorrow like the rest of us schmucks, or do you suppose they will grant him a competitive entry? I hope they all race PPM this summer (KJ, MC, TK, NC, ...). It will give the rest of us some fun viewing when we are still trying to get to A-Frame.
ReplyDeleteRob - KJ gets a comp entry no sweat.
ReplyDeleteJeff - thankful that compression gear does not have an exit flap.
Nick - I appear to be only 8 miles from the Marin Headlands Park from where I am in downtown. Can peds use the bridge?